A Podcast Of Ice and Fire
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Episode 136: The K and the Grey
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Author:  KCenturion [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 8:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Cool episode guys. I was very pleased to wake up to this today! :)

I think there were two separate occasions where Lysa took advantage of a desensitised Littlefinger back in the day and one of those occasions he thought he was with Catelyn. Which is why he brags that he claimed them both before Ned and Jon. The first was the night that Baelish and the Tully siblings got wasted after a feast and the Blackfish had to carry him off. The second is after his duel with Brandon when he was feverish. From the top of my head, I can't remember which time he thought was Cat and which was the time that resulted in Lysa's Tansy pregnancy. Probably in that order though.

Brandon's Companions:
- Elbert Arryn's dad was already dead by the time he was imprisoned so he probably died alone. :(
- Jeffory Mallister was probably Jason's nephew or younger brother. His father probably answered the summons and died too.
- Kyle Royce was probably Yohn's or Nestor's nephew. His father probably answered the summons and died too.
- Ethan Glover obviously survived to join Ned later. Probably Galbart/Robett's younger brother. I believe he was imprisoned in the Red Keep until the after the Sack and joined Ned on his march to Storm's End. I have a theory that Varys may have chosen to give him information (or let him overhear) on Lyanna's whereabouts and he shared it with Ned when they were away from the city.

I just had a thought and maybe Brandon was still mad about Rhaegar unhorsing him at the Tourney of Harrenhal and then word came down and he just over-reacted. I imagine something petty like that really getting on his nerves and this was just an excuse for him to call out Rhaegar for a rematch. I'm a fan of the theory that Benjen was involved here somewhere; the theory that he blames himself for the deaths of Rickard, Brandon and Lyanna and took the Black as soon as possible. Maybe he misheard why or misunderstood Lyanna riding off with Rhaegar? Benjen then rode back to Winterfell and traded "There must always be a Stark in Winterfell" places with Rickard who marched south to answer Aerys' summons.
Author:  aryastark7330 [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
I really liked this episode - Elena you have a really nice voice and awesome opinions (sorry if that sounds creepy!)

I'm looking forward to the show coming back so we get more podcast episodes and I get to listen to people talk about it who have read the books (and not just talk to my housemate who doesn't know Dany's name and just calls her 'dragon lady')
Author:  Valkyrist [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 4:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Something I've always wondered about that Catelyn chapter (and maybe it's as obvious as it seems), but what is the "passing kindness he never committed" that Jaime was loved for?

Was it that he pretended Tysha was a whore? Why would Tyrion love him for that? Especially considering it was immediately followed by the most traumatic event of his life.
Author:  aryastark7330 [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 5:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
It's kind of weird but I assume he is referring to the Tysha thing - maybe Tyrion thinks kindly of Jaime for trying to do something for him? He wasn't involved with the whole thing with Tywin. I can't think of anything else ...
Author:  Lady_Grey [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 10:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
aryastark7330 wrote:
It's kind of weird but I assume he is referring to the Tysha thing - maybe Tyrion thinks kindly of Jaime for trying to do something for him? He wasn't involved with the whole thing with Tywin. I can't think of anything else ...


Yeah, that's what I thought as well.

Thanks Arya! I'd love to hear you up there ;)
Author:  Amin [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
aryastark7330 wrote:
It's kind of weird but I assume he is referring to the Tysha thing - maybe Tyrion thinks kindly of Jaime for trying to do something for him? He wasn't involved with the whole thing with Tywin. I can't think of anything else ...


Yeah he thought Jaime was trying to help him out. Everything went was going well until Tywin punished them severely (and he could have just annulled the marriage instead of doing what he did). Causation wise, Jaime supposedly brought Tysha into his life, but Tyrion doesn't focus on that overly negatively. Or Jaime could be referring to the lie he was forced to say at the end, how it was not a true kindness even if Tywin tried to spin it that way, but either way, it must be related to Tysha.
Author:  aryastark7330 [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
I just had a crackpot thought - maybe 'loved by one' is referring to Cersei and that he joined the Kingsguard to be with her, but wasn't able to prevent her getting married to Robert?
Author:  Amin [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 12:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Did anyone understand the title reference? The title is usually the last thing I come up with after editing, so I don't spend much time on it. Not every episode has a standout title moment though, but I try to be creative when possible.
Author:  Valkyrist [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 12:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Amin wrote:
Did anyone understand the title reference? The title is usually the last thing I come up with after editing, so I don't spend much time on it. Not every episode has a standout title moment though, but I try to be creative when possible.

Is it referring to K(yle) and (Lady)Grey?
Author:  Varley [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Great episode guys. I need to relisten but totally psyched that you guys have a sponsor! Hopefully to fund Ashley's new computer....or at very least some new audio software! :D
Author:  mfalcon [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Very nice episode and I enjoyed the contributions of Lady Grey.
Author:  Alias [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
This was excellent, kudos to Lady Grey for bringing so much hilarity and knowledge. :D I feel like I empathize with Catelyn's decision purely on the basis that I just love kids, but it's nothing like the perspective of someone who's actually a parent.

In the wake of my insomnia last night, I also went and watched the Watamote BoK mentioned. It was really nice to hear Ashley express her feelings on social anxiety and to hear that an anime captures those challenges so well. Really expressed a lot of the issues I and I'm sure many other have had perfectly. :)
Author:  Amin [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Valkyrist wrote:
Amin wrote:
Did anyone understand the title reference? The title is usually the last thing I come up with after editing, so I don't spend much time on it. Not every episode has a standout title moment though, but I try to be creative when possible.

Is it referring to K(yle) and (Lady)Grey?


Yes, but why that title style in particular?
Author:  Lady_Grey [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Valkyrist wrote:
Amin wrote:
Did anyone understand the title reference? The title is usually the last thing I come up with after editing, so I don't spend much time on it. Not every episode has a standout title moment though, but I try to be creative when possible.

Is it referring to K(yle) and (Lady)Grey?


That's what I thought too... but if that's the case what about (A)min?? Surelyit should be Grey and the AK? 8-)

Image
Author:  jesicka309 [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Immediately I thought Pinky and the Brain. No idea why.
Author:  Pod's Plight [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
I thought of The Cay

Image

...and The Grey

Image
Author:  Valkyrist [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Lady_Grey wrote:
That's what I thought too... but if that's the case what about (A)min?? Surelyit should be Grey and the AK? 8-)

Image

Amin, can you retroactively change the title to that? ;)
Author:  witless chum [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
That Jaime line is odd, but I can't imagine anything else it could refer to besides supposedly creating this scene where Tyrion could lose his virginity to someone who actually loved him. I guess he's not fully expressing the thought, maybe because as self-centered as Jaime is, he's perceptive enough to notice that someone actually liking him is worth more than anything to Tyrion. It's hard to say whether he did Tyrion a favor by getting him to believe Tysha was a pro, given that Tyrion was forced by his father to participate in her gang rape. Just another of those insoluble choices, I guess. And egad, thinking again about what went down with Tysha, that's really some extra fuckedupedness, Mr. Martin.

P.S.- I still don't get the K and the Grey thing.
Author:  Amin [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
witless chum wrote:
P.S.- I still don't get the K and the Grey thing.


Nobody has, yet.
Author:  Tom 162 [ Tue Mar 18, 2014 10:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
The use of 'the' in the ep 136 title hasn't been accounted for yet. What do we have in the books of the form "The ___ and the ___"?

The princess and the queen? Respectively? Was there any mention of Kyle being princess-like during the episode?! Lady_Grey was sort of the queen of getting Christmas filks organised, right?

The bear and the maiden fair? At least that one rhymes, which would justify the abbreviation of Kyle to K. But then, why leave out the word 'Lady'?
Author:  Amin [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Tom 162 wrote:
The use of 'the' in the ep 136 title hasn't been accounted for yet. What do we have in the books of the form "The ___ and the ___"?

The princess and the queen? Respectively? Was there any mention of Kyle being princess-like during the episode?! Lady_Grey was sort of the queen of getting Christmas filks organised, right?

The bear and the maiden fair? At least that one rhymes, which would justify the abbreviation of Kyle to K. But then, why leave out the word 'Lady'?


A hint from a past post and bok topic:

Tom 162 wrote:
despite your being a pack of Janeway hotness deniers. ;) Thanks for the shout-out to my 'disturbingness' on that subject.
Author:  Nadia [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Lady Grey was so good in this episode. I'm glad someone finally brought a mom's perspective on Catelyn's actions. Jaime isn't exactly a trustworthy person and it was a slim chance he would return her daughters even if it was in his control, but she was thinking about her daughters' safety and most parents would make irrational decisions if they were in Cat's position.

Waymar Royce is Bronze Yohn's son. They stopped in Winterfell on their way to the Wall which is why when Sansa reaches the Vale she's afraid Bronze Yohn might recognize her.
Author:  Vaarsuvius [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
aryastark7330 wrote:
I really liked this episode - Elena you have a really nice voice and awesome opinions (sorry if that sounds creepy!)

I'm looking forward to the show coming back so we get more podcast episodes and I get to listen to people talk about it who have read the books (and not just talk to my housemate who doesn't know Dany's name and just calls her 'dragon lady')


I've told at least 2 guest hosts that they are really nice to listen to. I guess that nets me a good amount of creepy points. Well, I don't wanna be an underachiever, so... Lady Grey, allow me to say that you have a really pleasant voice in addition to the already pleasant freckles.

PS Lol, Dragon Lady? I know people that think Dany's name is Khaleesi :( All the nerd rage! I keep thinking, WWMD?
Author:  Valkyrist [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Nadia wrote:
Lady Grey was so good in this episode. I'm glad someone finally brought a mom's perspective on Catelyn's actions. Jaime isn't exactly a trustworthy person and it was a slim chance he would return her daughters even if it was in his control, but she was thinking about her daughters' safety and most parents would make irrational decisions if they were in Cat's position.

Waymar Royce is Bronze Yohn's son. They stopped in Winterfell on their way to the Wall which is why when Sansa reaches the Vale she's afraid Bronze Yohn might recognize her.

I think part of what drove her insane at the end of the Red Wedding chapter was the suggestion that Jaime had helped execute it, and thus Robb's blood was on her hands.
Author:  Eiffel [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 6:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Great job Lady Grey!

I think it was Kyle that mentioned the parent filter for Catelyn and it absolutely exists. Before my two girls came, Cat's actions seemed selfish but after I completely understand them.

Is this is the first time that we see how great Jamie is? I like how we also see a differant lens on the Lannister wit.

I heard earlier this week Dany referred to as Stormborn from a show watcher. I was slightly impressed before educating him.
Author:  Varley [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 7:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
So regarding the fireplace secret passage way I think I have the visual: The fireplace scene in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.
Author:  Eiffel [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 8:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Varley wrote:
So regarding the fireplace secret passage way I think I have the visual: The fireplace scene in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade.


That is exactly what I was thinking!

I think fireplaces were much bigger in medieval times. The castles I visited in Turkey and Germany as a kid were much bigger than what you see in houses today and I can see Tyrion walking around one.
Author:  Alias [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
So long as people don't start calling her Mhysa, I'll be fine.

The "K and the Grey" thing is a Star Trek reference, but I don't know anything about Star Trek so I can't say what it is.

I did some research (goooogle) and I guess "The Q and the Grey" is a Voyager episode. At least I vaguely know who Q is. Hope that isn't cheating.
Author:  Amin [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Alias wrote:
So long as people don't start calling her Mhysa, I'll be fine.

The "K and the Grey" thing is a Star Trek reference, but I don't know anything about Star Trek so I can't say what it is.


Yes we talked about star trek bok and it was one letter off, plus I figured it might spawn deeper meaning interpretations anyway :ugeek:
Author:  jesicka309 [ Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Episode 136: The K and the Grey
Thanks for dobbing me in on the filks, Lady Grey. I might have to upload it anyway, as I had a computer crash last September and lost everything anyway. So I don't trust technology to hold my stuff until next Christmas. :p
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