He was also mentioned a couple of times in the first season of the TV show, though only in passing.

Definitely a fun episode to listen to... and it was impossible not to be amused by Amin's Don Quixote-esque quest for more guest hosts.

Though I was somewhat baffled by Larry's equivocation of Cersei's intention to spare Tommen the horror of death by burning with Sansa's failure to rid the realm of Joffery via the parapets of the Red Keep. It's been a while since I've seen last year's finale, but IIRC, it's pretty clear that regicide is exactly Sansa's intention, prevented only by the Hound's intervention. I'm not sure how that is supposed to parallel Cersei's situation with Tommen but regardless, I think Sansa deserves credit for trying.

(But I will admit that I personally tend to dismiss any fan-suggested character action which requires a given character to bring about their own deaths. It doesn't matter if it's Vargo Hoat or Old Nan, or how much good their heroic/sacrificial deaths might enable, or how profoundly a character might need redemption. I don't see it as fair or reasonable to expect from any character; it undermines the human realities so well presented in the series.)

I doubt that is Sophie because she is too short. It also looks like the same girl from the video version as well.

Was not expecting all the Larry hate from listening to this podcast. I may not agreed with a him on a few things but damn. He is pissed off quiet a few people.

Hmm, good point. Another Larry episode too, lol - times change and yet they don't

... and moon boy for all you know.

BEST combination of two random characters EVER btw.

So your three most commented episodes (52, 59, 80) all had Larry! Sounds like he makes for good ratings.

@Amin: If you are looking for Skype alternatives i would definately take a look at Mumble. The voice codec is absolutely outstanding. It also has build in recorder but i have no experience with that. I think Mumble servers are available for very little costs.

EDIT: If you want to test it i have access to a server, PM me if so.

first off, mad props to Amin and Ashley for putting up another podcast so soon. Appreciate all the hard work you guys do-gotta take care of my game of thrones fix somehow lol

linecom and cosmia have voices tailor made for podcasting - well spoken and very insightful. Good additions.

Amin did a good job stepping in the background, guiding the show through each topic and letting the guest hosts shine.

As another person alluded to earlier, I think Larry went into full on self defense mechanism mode once the Sansa issue was brought into light.

Larry's critique of Stannis' battle plans could have easily been avoided if he just paid attention to how rare Wildfire was and how could anyone know they had that? Sometimes he speaks from knowledge that only the audience is privy to.

i'm not gonna get into critiquing the silly things he says regarding Stannis on the wall too much (enemies slashing swords all around you and he wants Stannis to put away his sword and start tossing em over? Leaving himself vulnerable to other sword attacks while trying to lift 200 pounds over waist high walls? c'mon... lol that's a terrible suggestion)

he does provide value to the podcast as a non book reader and his reactions in most episodes were a good gauge as to what details were adequately reaching the non book reading audience. His attention to detail has been starting to go downhill lately and his usually insightful comments and replaced by overemphasized generalisms.

Larry's in a bit of a slump, I do hope he gets over the haters (f' em!) and gets his head back to genuine interest of the series again. I still enjoy his viewpoints.

haven't gotten through all of the podcast yet but its good to have it ready to go for tomorrow's commute. Thanks guys

Big fan of Augustine. I'd sign a petition to make him a permanent host. Only problem was with him always asking Larry questions, interview style, which segways into what i didn't like...
Larry. He was fun and novel when the show first came out, and deserved to be invited on the podcast, but his act has gone stale and his true colors have come out. That $$ comment was ridiculous, and I feel like that, along with attention drive his youtube reviews, not because he likes the show. It's all an act now, one that which besides rehearsing for his Neds dead reaction, he puts no time into.
Ultimately this is a podcast by book readers, for book readers, and having a person on who hasn't, severely restricts the open dialogue about the adaptation. (makes it less enjoyable).

great suggestion Ashley about having Seanzoz on, I would love that.

I have up to this point enjoyed Larry's reviews and his appearances on the podcast. And I say this as someone who has previously defended his opinion of Sansa. But in episode 80 it felt different.

At several points I found Larry to be condescending and borderline offensive, particularly in his opinion that there is only one correct response to traumatic situations. Good on the hosts for calling him out on this.

He frequently complains that Sansa doesn't do anything but does not address the follow-up question of what could Sansa do differently when she is thousands of miles from any Stark bannermen, all of her friends, servants and household guards are dead, everyone at court is loyal to the queen and she is at the mercy of a king who enjoys having her beaten for any reason or no reason at all?

Even when he is asked directly by the hosts what he thinks that Sansa could do besides become a martyr he still did not answer.

A reviewer should have strong opinions, that is what draws people in and gets them interested. But at the same time they should be able to qualify those opinions.

There are people who are “book purists”, Larry strikes me as, for lack of a better term, a “genre purist”. That when things do not conform to genre tropes that they must be wrong or inferior to ones that do. This has happened to me. I have been in situations where my preconceived ideas about what a work should be have prevented me from enjoying it for what it actually is.

A trope of many works of fiction is that when protagonists are put in difficult situations they automatically become stronger and overcome them. Sansa certainly has changed but being confronted with a bad situation does not automatically confer the ability or the will to change that situation.

I have otherwise found Larry's opinions as a show-only viewer to be valuable and interesting and as long as the hosts have a good rapport with him he should continue to guest host. It isn't like all of the regular podcast hosts have never held unpopular opinions. I would just like to see him be called to defend his opinions when he makes these broad, no-middle-ground assertions like when you you encounter a traumatic event you automatically change for the better, that everyone who disagrees with him is jealous or that all hate comes from jealousy...

Regarding his lack of enthusiasm, remember that Larry has been spoiled for several huge events that happen in the third book and that may be contributing to it.

Ep 80 now has the record, lol.

BTW, if linecom1 wasn't already titled the podcast doctor, I would probably add him to the podcast kingsguard . His post in the comments on the main page was something that needed to be said, but also something best coming from a listener and not the hosts themselves. Then again, linecom1 was already dubbed the "mad dog of the podcast": even podcast lords & ladies need someone to let loose and get the job done from time to time

@ Amin:

I don't think any of the hate was directed at the normal organisers of the podcast, for example yourself, Mimi, and the guests such as linecom1 or Augustine. Rather people feel incensed by Larry. I can't speak for anyone but me, but I've listened to your podcast for hours and hours (and I am one of those people who feels compelled to start and not finish until it is done) and I am grateful for entertaining and intelligent dialogue that has to do with something I love (ASOIAF).

The reason that critics come out for this episode, including myself, is twofold. Our expectations and what we like are: 1) What the podcast is, a fairly rigorous and funny discussion of the TV series and the books by likeable personalities and 2) the expectation of this episode, being one of the most important and coolest you will ever get to discuss on the podcast.

Now imagine our dismay when we tune in to hear Larry who automatically means 1) No spoilers for the entire scene by scene recap (meaning no in depth discussion and lots left unsaid) and who is frankly a 2)dim observer (I watch this with others who got more than he did, also not book readers) and 3)brings up specious points and borderline insulting dialogue and speaks over other hosts who might have something bright to say.

Yesterday, I tried the podcast again, and was able to get through the portion of him being in it.

When he brought up if Augustine was in "mortal danger" I started flipping tables. I was in the 2010 Chilean 8.8 earthquake and I can say that people have wildly different responses to traumatic events. Some suck it up, others go to pieces, some are frozen, others hyperactive... just as varied as anything in life.

I've never been a Sansa fan per se, and I remember hating her at the appropriate moments, but I realise she is a flawed little girl, and not her sister - she has always been more Tully than Stark and the book goes to lengths to point this out. I also think hosts backed off him for fear of setting off another pointless rant, which is just as tiresome to listen to as it is to record, I imagine.

Basically, people react badly to Larry because he runs counter to what the podcast is, and listener expectations of it.

Yeah mortal danger is a pretty interesting one, It'd be interesting to hear some vets speak about that (but of course not something I'd bring up casually )

But from personal experience and encounters it's determined by your current health level really.. but if you've energy to burn, it's incredibly focusing in the way that your body knows and moves automatically to defend itself or others. Though I would not judge Sansa let alone anyone on those same personal parameters of course. Sansa has really grown on me over time. Emotional turmoil takes nerves of steel! PTSD is PTSD, people can see a thrice-broken nose and scars a plenty , but it takes a far better eye to see someone with whose myelin sheaths have become eroded far beyond their age.

I agree. And while the danger Sansa experiences in Kings Landing is close to constant, it is not "sword-at-your-throat, fight-or-flight, lift-a-car" kind of danger. Sansa is trapped in the Game of Thrones, not the Hunger Games-- her survival mechanisms are by absolute necessity as subtle and self-degrading as she can make them. The right words keep Sansa just as not-dead as the right sword-motion-whatever keeps Jon, and she'd be just as sliced and diced if she failed as he would; it's just that Sansa's percolating survival is a lot less sexily fictional than the characters who can afford to beat their spears on shields and howl at the sky.

thanks, but yeah i'm certainly happy with my current title...........plus i would like to take wives and father children (dont judge me bro).........

@starkgaryan @mattthehuman

thanks for the kind words


@skagosunicorn - thanks for clarifying, your latest post was well thought out and certainly reasonable.......

by the way........is it just me.......or is there a



goiing on on the comment tree of the home page.........more like a poewar.............. of course i've been wrong about

before so im happy to be corrected by poe himself if needs be......

For the most part that is quite true like your own feedback for example, but there has been some hate spilled onto the podcast crew via comments, sidewall and a couple emails in particular. Not that we are not used to it, as mimi noted, and the on forum feedback often seems to be the most constructive since you need to (somewhat) stand behind what you say here.

There is definitely a few poe fights going on in the comments area, I think Ashley is brave for wading into the mobs there . The comment area on the main page is inherently a different sort of zone than the forum here. While some people do use a steady alias as linecom asked for, a lot don't, whereas in the forum you need to stand behind your comments under a set name. Anyway, it is refreshing to see linecom and other forumers responding in a calm, mature way in the comments area, on some of the recent threads in our forums and on other websites, so the hosts can focus on what they do best: producing episodes.

I always lose track on that Comment-Thing. I know there may be 20 comments I have not read, but I'm never able to find them. I ignore it most times.

The podcast-episode was awesome - especially the latter part. As I'm not able to wathc S2 where I live life, I wait for the DVD to support HBO. So I always hear the first part of the epsiodes but have no expectations...

I also found Larry a little disturbing this time (his $$-comment and the trauma-thing especially), but maybe linecom1(?) was right by saying he may not be as invested anymore because he knows/fears the Starks are on a lost cause (as we all [have] fear[ed] a little bit). But I would not say that he never should return. Maybe you invite him once BEFORE and once AFTER the season in the future. Ask him in both cases how he thinks it might go on and afterwards what he especially feared/liked and wodered about in the season. So you get a "greater" picture from him and have not dance around spoilers because you don't know what might happen in the latter episodes of the season. And he may not have the need to comment on every scene in a smartass way.

I felt compelled to back Ashley up in that regard since I very often agree with her where Sansa is concerned, but I think I'm going to step off before my normal rational self derails into incoherent raging, LOL.

whoa brynden, you are the man, and im always hesitant to question you, but im positive i was not the one that made that comment(s), i think you have me confused for someone else.......

Also, this is a pretty amazing essay about basically what I always try to get at regarding Sansa but never seem to be able to phrase properly:

http://feministfiction.wordpress.com/20 ... /#more-106

I seem to have quite a reputation here. don't know why If it was not you, I don't know who it was, sorry. Somebody here or on the Comment-Thing (I really tried to follow there but I gave up) said such a thing and I found that a good explanation.

Actually, not really. If you think about it, Sansa's naivite, her trust int the goodness and honor of others, and her expectation that life follows certain established rules recalls Ned quite powerfully. (Whereas Arya's preceptive nature, shrewdness and ability to make quick decisions is quite remeniscent of her Tully mother.) Certainly, Sansa is attracted to the richness and color of Southren life, but she also takes comfort int the godswood and shores up her courage by reminding herself that she is a "Stark of Winterfell"--even in her most irritating first-book moments.

Bottom line, Stark and Tully are not as disparate as we are initially led to believe, and one is not synonymous with strength while the other indicates weakness.

Thats an awesome point, inkasrain. I've actually never thought of it that way before.

http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=34164

Audio interview with the director of the episode talking about the filming.

I don't believe that Starks are indicative of strength and Tullys of weakness, but I do believe that in terms of her story arc she is going in the Tully direction of her gene pool. Take her mother, Catelyn, who as a southerner has some clue as to how the game is played, who is important and generally knows how southern politics functions. She moves inside that world (makes lots of horrible errors) but in general is aware of the risks of being in KL and what that means. She understands courtly life.

Sansa I think is moving in this direction, of becoming a cultured southern lady, who can play the game, and knows how to use language and formality to defend herself politically, rather than just the sword. I think her emphasis on propriety as a means of survival at court is a major indication of where she is going. There is also the fact that she is about to take a 1-on-1 work study colloquium on playing the game from the best (or one of the best) game-players in Westeros - Littlefinger, which means that she is going to be a political manipulator par exellance at some point.

To my mind her story arc recalls to potential parallels:

1) One is to Ser Barristan Selmy, who notes that while he is normally a fairly Ned-like honour-bound fighter, has basically received an education on the game of thrones from simply being around powerful people for so long. Sansa has been around to see the miscalculations of her father, the madness of Geoff, Crazy Circei, the battle at KL.... then plenty of stupidity and manipulation at the Eyrie ...so she must have an idea of how power functions, and perhaps much like Selmy she will get a crack at being in charge of something at some point.

2) The story of Palamon and Arcite from Chaucer's the Knight's tale is maybe a parallel to Sansa/Arya. One is contemplative, shut up, imprisoned, while the other is free-ranging and active... yet both originally(San/Arya) just wanted to go home, or be with their group. Maybe like Palamon and Arcite they will both end up in the same place, even though they took hugely different paths to get there.

Okay, I hear what you're saying. Though I don't think that Sansa's induction into the game has as much to do with Tully proclivities (in contrast to Stark characteristics) as it does the fact that she's in the right (or wrong, I guess, depending on how you look at it) place at the right/wrong time. Obviously she, like Catelyn, has the tools to play, but I'm not convinced that this ability is a purely Tully/Southern trait. Edmure and Lysa are hilariously bad at intrigue of any kind at all, and recent information suggests that Rickard Stark was quite willing to mess around in the Game of Thrones despite his status as the reigning Stark in Winterfell.

But I appreciate that you don't conflate Stark with strength and Tully with weakness. A lot of fan seem to buy into that worldview, and it colors their understanding of characters in unfortunate ways, in my opinion.



Interesting observation; from your description it seems like a potential parallel, but I could never get that far into The Canterbury Tales

First off- great work Ashley and Amin! Clearly APoIaF AA's staying power puts both Energizer and Duracell to shame!

Hound vs. Bronn? I feel that the Hound would win, but Rory McCann would still somehow lose.

Now, back to my bath! 3 ... Jaqen, I think I dropped the soap again...

Very long-time listener and I love love love this podcast and all the hosts.

However, I finally posted to give feedback about the guest host guy who classlessly feels the need to put down other GoT podcasts. This guy needs to go, he reflects badly on all the entertaining and talented people who are original hosts and even the other guest hosts! His insecurity and jealousy are making the entire podcast seem pathetic - and I love everyone else so I'm sad about this!

I listen to many other SoIaF podcasts, and they have different purposes: tv only, tv book, no spoilers, spoilers, etc. TV-only folks interpret things differently than bookies and I like hearing that (I really like Larry btw).

I'm looking for good discussion and a diverse range of perspectives, which this podcast tends to do repeatedly.

Thanks for the hard work you do to bring us such Manwoodish fun, and my condolences on Insecure Guy.

Ps. Where's the bathtub pic? I'm dying to see it!